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The Yell is back

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Original Message Post # 1
Fri 4th Jul 2008 22:57

Joined: 06/12/2010
Topics: 1 Replies: 7

During the seminar course in Calabro,Italy (May 3-4, 2008) with Our Grand Master Choi.
I was surprised when the yell is back. I remember 15 years ago when I'm still living in my country (Philippines) we practiced HYUNG , but when i came here in Italy everything was changes, the way they performed the pattern and the yell. The Yell is back "great" but my problem is i forgot where should i put the yell, i remember from Chon-ji up to Do-San. Where should i put the yell in the Tul, "Please kindly help me".
By the way I'm Juanito Arsol Jr. 5th degree Black Belt - I.T.F. Taekwon-Do Italia.

Thank you
Post # 2
Top Fri 4th Jul 2008 23:15
Mr Snow

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Sir, If you are on about the Ki-Opts in Tuls here they are -

C-J #17
D-G #8 and #17

D-S #6 and #22

W-H #12

Y-G #24 #27 and #36

J-G #12

T-G #29

H-R #14 and #25

C-M #9 (on the execution of the knife hand guarding block) and on #19 (on the landing)

K-G #23 and #27

P-E #12 and #30

G-B #19 and #28

Tae Kwon
C.R.SNOW 5TH DEGREE
WWW.UK-LTSI.COM
Post # 3
Top Fri 4th Jul 2008 23:19

Joined: 06/12/2010
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Thank You very much,Sir
Post # 4
Top Fri 4th Jul 2008 23:43
M. Hildering

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Aren't there any kihaps in the tuls above?

Or are these not yet integrated with the kihaps yet?
Taekwon!
Post # 5
Top Sat 5th Jul 2008 00:20

Joined: 06/12/2010
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There is kihap in tul and it was remove by Gen. Choi, because it make to noise and now Grand Master Choi put again kihap it tul.
Believe me kihap in tul it 's great!
Post # 6
Top Sat 5th Jul 2008 01:18
user16365

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Good question, Mr Arsol! And thanks, Mr Snow, for your response.

I remember my first seminar with GM Choi several years ago in Melbourne, when he explained to us where the kihap should happen in some of the patterns. He didn't seem too bothered whether we did it or not at the time, and I got the feeling it was some kind of option, if we felt like it....

I like it: it adds some zest to the pattern and emphasises certain movements. But it throws up a couple of questions, which I'd like to raise here:

1) Why do the kihaps occur where they do (according to Mr Snow's response above)? I have always thought of the kihap as an aggressive, attacking accompaniment to foster more power (read 'chi energy') into a movement. i would expect that to occur on attacking movements only. However, several of the places in the patterns above where kihaps occur are blocks. That makes sense in some ways, i suppose, but I don't really understand why you would kihap on the last rising block in Dan-gun, for example.

2) Where did you get your info, Mr Snow? Is it published anywhere? (Not doubting you at all, just curious.)

3) Are there kihaps in the patterns from Eui-Am onwards? You stop at Gye-Baek....

cheers, P
Post # 7
Top Sat 5th Jul 2008 03:53
Master Rai

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Taekwon
 
The Ki-haps are in the movements that are mentioned by Mr. Snow. Patterns Eui-am to Tong-il are on the process of having the ki-haps instilled.
 
Pres.Choi advised that Gen. Choi always liked the ki-haps but they got out of hand getting away from the purpose of the ki-hap. Taekwon-Do practitioners began to make different sounds and thus Gen. Choi removed them.
 
Since Pres. Choi knows how Gen. Choi felt about the ki-haps he has decided to put them back.
 
I can tell you from my travels with Pres. Choi, the ki-haps bring an enormous energy when performed by students.
 
Taekwn
 
Master Rai
Special assistant to Pres. Choi.
 
 
Master Parm Rai
Post # 8
Top Sat 5th Jul 2008 04:35
user16365

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Thank you, Master Rai.

This forum is amazing. Where else can you get such authoratitive answers to questions like this so quickly?

I'm impressed!

P
Post # 9
Top Sat 5th Jul 2008 10:56
Mr Snow

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Mr Steele Sir,
                      I don't know where they came from but some one posted a few months back, If you search ki-ops you will find the topic, We did NOT use ki-ops ourselves but according to our seniors that post here these are the correct places, my group have been installinging them into the TULS since I think we are on joon-gun as we only do one or two patern per month to insure they work before moving to the next tul.
 
Tae Kwon
 
PS - The ITF admin are doing  a great job these days, like you said this web is fab but dont forget to sign up to www.tkdsource.com   NOW , thats gonna take us to the future.
C.R.SNOW 5TH DEGREE
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Post # 10
Top Sat 5th Jul 2008 12:28

Joined: 06/12/2010
Topics: 1 Replies: 7

Master Rai,

I'm agree with you, Sir.

Taekwon


Post # 11
Top Sat 5th Jul 2008 15:08
Mr Snow

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Bliamy, That meens I gota find where they are for 2nd 3rd, 4th and 5th Degree, Will these be available on the TKD SOURCE site Master Rai,
C.R.SNOW 5TH DEGREE
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Post # 12
Top Sat 5th Jul 2008 18:34

Joined: 06/12/2010
Topics: 1 Replies: 7
I have a complete books (HYUNG) of Grand Master hee il cho, if only my brother find it.
Post # 13
Top Sun 6th Jul 2008 03:29
user16365

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Thanks for the tip on that earlier thread, Mr Snow. Having only just arrived, I don't know what's been discussed.

I do think that there's room on this forum for a separate 'tul' page, but the wiser heads have probably already thought about that.

On the reintroduction of kihaps: I think it's good and, like I said, it was exciting to hear GM Choi mention them way back in January 2003 - until then, I had never known that the ITF had ever had kihaps in patterns. I can see Master Rai's explanation for why they were removed (around 1996? just at the beginning of my ITF time) and I can understand why they are being put back.

Now, what I don't understand is this: why all the secrecy? Why allow rumours to start and have people going off tangentially about things that could be cleared up on this website with a simple statement and accompanying set of instructions regarding where the kihaps belong? (I suppose I already know the answer to my own question!)

Hey! It's great to be back!

P

PS - G'day Jon - afraid I've heard nothing from Marvin for a year or so either.
Post # 14
Top Sun 6th Jul 2008 22:16
M. Hildering

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I don't want to offend anyone,

But i wonder; the kihaps were removed back then because it got out of control (everyone was 'making up' his own 'sound'),

Now the kihaps are back in the game, but aren't you afraid that it will go the same way as back then? Having people creating their 'own' kihaps?
Taekwon!
Post # 15
Top Mon 7th Jul 2008 12:18
Master Rai

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Mr. Hildering

You are correct sir. This is why it is important to attend seminars. The ITF are re-introducing the kihaps at the seminars. Pres. Choi is xplaining the proper explainantion of kihaps at the seminars. This will create a more unified way of doing the kihaps.

Taekwon
Master Parm Rai
Post # 16
Top Mon 7th Jul 2008 22:35
M. Hildering

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Thank you for your reply Master Rai!

I was at the seminar last year in Holland, and i must say that i find the kihaps very useful as it makes you more confident just by yelling. The atmosphere was really great when everyone shouted 'kihap'. I can't really explain, but it felt like we were all one. One family with the same purpose; performing Taekwon-do the best we can, and trying to live 'Do'.
 
Although when i'm assisting my instructor, i also ask students to kihap, but it's quite difficult to have them do it, because it's some kind of shame i guess that they don't like to kihap. Is there a way for them to practice it? Or having them get familiar with the idea?
Taekwon!
Post # 17
Top Tue 8th Jul 2008 15:09

Joined: 06/12/2010
Topics: 1 Replies: 7
Mr. Hildering

To be familiar in kihap, you must start to the basic program for example:
1. 3 steps sparring last number kihap
2. or 5 steps forward with low block last number kihap and in every last numbers there must be kihap.
step by step they will familiarize with kihap and then they will understand what kihap means (10 times push-up if they not doing kihap).

In my dojang we have to type of kihap:
1. long way when where doing kicking in pads
2. short and sharp during punching, blocking and breaking techniques.
This system i have learned to my father late Master Arsol.

Taekwon

Post # 18
Top Wed 9th Jul 2008 11:03

Joined: 02/11/2010
Topics: 1 Replies: 8

Sirs,

May I ask, whilst breaking, I have noticed at tournaments that most practitioners when breaking do not use KIHAP, Why is this?? would the use of KIHAP increase focus and concentration at the point of impact ??? I believe most other Martial Arts would incorporate this when breaking. ANY thoughts on this
Tae Kwon.
Post # 19
Top Wed 9th Jul 2008 18:06

Joined: 06/12/2010
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Mr. Brennan, Sir

1. Q. Most practitioners at tournaments when breaking do not use Ki-hap?
A. They did but soundless, instead they blowing air as same as yelling but yelling
with sound it is better because it give the air a Boost.

2. Q. Focus and Concentration at the point of impact?
A. In power breaking I think yelling before breaking increase your focus and concentration
and yelling the same time at the point of impact increase the power.

Taekwon.
Post # 20
Top Thu 10th Jul 2008 10:11

Joined: 02/11/2010
Topics: 1 Replies: 8
Mr. Arsol sir
Thank you for your reply, and I hope to put to use propper Ki-Hap at training and especially at tournaments, not only to increase focus and power, but I suppose for the attention, especially if I manage to break. (Ha Ha )
Taekwon Sir.
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